>> The full extent of Helene’s destructive toll just now coming into focus.

>> All of a sudden we get a notice that says, "The dam is at critical level.

Hit the high ground immediately."

>> The water started gushing down the side of the mountain.

>> He was found right along the bank.

This is not how anybody deserved to go.

>> The whole community is just destroyed.

Everything’s gone.

>> NARRATOR: Drawing on a decade of reporting on disasters and their aftermath.

>> This is Laura Sullivan.

>> NARRATOR: NPR correspondent Laura Sullivan investigates America’s continuing vulnerability to climate change-related storms.

>> You’ve had several major storms in the past couple decades.

What makes you think a storm like this won’t happen again?

>> There’s no guarantee a storm like this won’t happen again, but I think everything is a risk.

>> The cost to society, to our country for these storm events is astronomical.

>> NARRATOR: Now on FRONTLINE, Hurricane Helene’s Deadly Warning.

(heavy rain falling) (crane rumbling) (chainsaw buzzing) ♪ ♪ (dog panting) (indistinct chatter) ♪ ♪ >> SULLIVAN: It's like the apocalypse.

(voiceover): We came to North Carolina five days after Hurricane Helene tore through the region.

More than 100,000 were still without power.

Tens of thousands had no water... ...and the death toll was rising.

♪ ♪ The Riverlink Bridge had become a gathering point for local residents.

Did you see it when the water was here?

>> Yeah, it was... it was insane, like, I've never...

It was all the way up here.

>> SULLIVAN: So these buildings, could you see them?

>> The tops of, like, well, basically the first level was underwater.

♪ ♪ >> We always thought that, 'cause we was in the mountains... >> SULLIVAN: Yeah.

>> ...that it wouldn't, it wouldn't happen.

It's unexplainable, really.

>> SULLIVAN: Yeah.

>> We watched whole houses just crumble and go down the river, trucks turned end over end.

Nothing-- I've never seen nothing like it.

(flood waters rushing) >> SULLIVAN: Phone service had been down for days, making it hard for families and friends to find one another.

>> Free water!

Free food!

>> SULLIVAN: Hundreds of people were still unaccounted for.

Hi!

Good, how are you?

Is this the list?

>> No, this isn't a complete list.

This is just the ones that we've had people come through.

>> SULLIVAN: And if they're safe, like, this person... >> The arrow says that they've been found.

>> SULLIVAN: And then you still have some missing people.

>> Yes, there's probably more than that, but that's the ones we have names for.

♪ ♪ Zubila Shafiq's husband, Omar, was among the missing.

They'd recently separated, and he'd moved to this apartment complex close to a river that had flooded.

>> I saw some people walking by, and they're like-- I said, I'm looking for somebody, I'm looking for somebody.

I'm looking for Omar.

She said, um, "I tried to save him, I'm so sorry; I tried to save him."

And then she explained to me, she said, I saw him, and he was... up there, he was panicking.

>> SULLIVAN: A neighbor captured what happened on her cellphone.

(tearfully): I'm sorry, I just, I don't understand what these poor people had to go through.

To imagine what it's like, to be seeing all this water.

Everything is leaving and the fear he must have had.

♪ ♪ >> SULLIVAN: Omar's building was carried down the river.

Every night I think about it-- the fear.

♪ ♪ (inhales) (sobs) It's unimaginable.

It's unimaginable to think, to see this rushing wave of water and he can't swim and nobody, even if you can swim, there's no way.

And I just, I don't understand, like, how that must have felt for him, and I can't, like, I think about it every night, the fear he must have had.

How scared he must have been.

♪ ♪ >> SULLIVAN: People from around the region had come to offer help.

>> Bunch of water and granola bars in our bags, you know, just to offer to people and... >> SULLIVAN: Allegra West had narrowly escaped a landslide in the hills outside of town.

>> It was incredibly nerve wracking, yeah.

There's, uh, there's no water on that property.

We're on the side of the mountain there.

>> SULLIVAN: Oh, my God.

>> Yeah, at about 8:00 a.m., I looked out my window and the water started gushing down the side of the mountain.

>> SULLIVAN: She filmed out the window as the water surged down the hillside.

Her neighbor's house was knocked over.

What about the people?

>> The gentleman was, was in a tree.

>> SULLIVAN: Oh, no.

>> Clearly had a broken back and other things; he was still alive.

>> SULLIVAN: He was still alive?!

What did you do?

Well, we held his hand and, you know, prayed with him and spoke to him and took down any notes of what he wanted to say.

>> SULLIVAN: So he died?

>> Yes.

We spent the rest of the day searching the rubble for his wife.

They found her at about 12:30 there in the rubble.

And they're together now, and yeah... >> SULLIVAN: We were hearing that the worst damage was in towns like hers, miles outside of Asheville, in the Blue Ridge Mountains.

It was difficult to get around; many roads were impassable and buried under mud, cutting off survivors from critical aid.

How many people are missing at this point, do you think?

>> Do you know how many were on that missing persons board?

>> I do not.

>> We're getting varying ranges of numbers.

Anywhere between you know, under a hundred to upwards of 700.

>> SULLIVAN: Yeah.

Oh, my God.

(voiceover): We managed to get to the town of Swannanoa.

To the same hillside where Allegra's neighbors were killed.

>> All that water come down that hill, hit that house, shoved it over there, and then the rest of it came and hit this house, drug it down there.

And that don't look like a house, but it is.

>> SULLIVAN (voiceover): Steve Gibson was still cleaning up.

(on camera): Do you feel like it was a safe place to live?

>> Oh, yeah, yeah, because when we heard about the flood, we go, well, we're up here on the hill, ain't nothing going to happen to us.

Then all this happened, and it's, like... We didn't know there was gonna be a landslide.

>> SULLIVAN: Right, that it would take half the mountain down.

>> Yeah.

♪ ♪ >> SULLIVAN: The rains that triggered the landslides caused the Swannanoa River to overflow its banks by more than 26 feet.

Ben Larrabee's whole neighborhood was inundated.

>> All of a sudden we get a notice that says, "The dam is at critical level.

Hit the high ground immediately."

>> SULLIVAN: Oh, my God.

>> (on video): And I've already called 9-1-1.

There's nothing they can do.

(in person): It was just raising so fast, you couldn't make decisions.

>> SULLIVAN: What did you see going on next door?

>> Well, I saw him pop out every once in a while on his deck.

>> SULLIVAN: He briefly spotted his next door neighbor.

There he is.

>> See, it's already almost to his knees, yeah.

>> SULLIVAN: It's on his feet!

>> That's the last time that I've seen him.

(on video): Man, I don't know what to do, guys.

(in person): When the water finally subsided and I got out, they were the only ones that weren't here.

♪ ♪ >> SULLIVAN: The couple, Nola and Robert Ramsuer, were still unaccounted for.

Their daughter, Shalana Jordan, was there trying to figure out what had happened to her parents.

>> All the other neighbors have been found.

My parents were the only ones that haven't been found yet.

>> SULLIVAN: What, what are your thoughts?

>> I, I don't know.

>> SULLIVAN: If they were to go into the river, maybe try to escape.

>> Neither one of them can swim.

>> SULLIVAN: They can't swim?

>> Neither one of them can swim.

(groans) This looks like the master bathroom.

(sniffles) What's left of it.

>> SULLIVAN: So this is your dad, this is your mom.

and you're an only child.

>> Yeah.

>> SULLIVAN: So you're going through this by yourself.

>> Yeah.

I just can't imagine what they went through, and if... (sobbing): And if they did get washed away, like what they did by themselves, they died alone.

(sobs) >> SULLIVAN: I'm so sorry.

>> The whole community is just destroyed.

Everything's gone.

(sniffles) It looks like a war zone.

♪ ♪ >> SULLIVAN: The devastation here was a shock so far inland, in the North Carolina mountains.

And it was a vivid sign of how even places like this are now vulnerable to climate-related storms.

(siren wailing) But Helene was actually a signal of even more-- one of the most striking examples I'd seen in years of reporting on disasters, of how communities are struggling to make themselves safer and prepare for the next storm.

(bird squawking) Over the past decade with NPR and "Frontline," I've been covering the impact and recovery from disasters like Helene, going back to superstorm Sandy's destruction in New York and New Jersey.

>> Major damage along the entire New Jersey coast... >> Flooding nearly twenty percent of the Big Apple... >> SULLIVAN: Hurricane Maria, that plunged Puerto Rico into darkness.

>> Everywhere damaged infrastructure, blocked roads, and devastated homes.

>> SULLIVAN: Irma that tore through Florida.

>> Irma's wrath is visible as far as the eye can see... >> SULLIVAN: And Harvey, that left much of Houston under water.

>> That is equivalent to about a trillion gallons of water... >> SULLIVAN: The federal government spends more than $50 billion a year helping communities recover-- including properties that have flooded repeatedly.

(on camera): You had four floods... >> In three years.

>> SULLIVAN (voiceover): In an endless cycle of destruction and rebuilding.

This is Laura Sullivan from NPR and PBS.

For the past eight months, we've been investigating the forces fueling this cycle.

And following how it is continuing to play out in North Carolina.

>> Residents say they feel like they've been left behind and forgotten waiting for government funding so they can rebuild their lives.

>> SULLIVAN: We could see that cycle underway as we returned to Asheville repeatedly in the months after Helene.

Most of the missing had been accounted for.

But more than 100 people were dead, including Zubila Shafiq's husband, Omar.

>> He was found just a little bit back there.

Right along the bank.

(exhales) >> SULLIVAN: This is your first time back here?

>> I haven't really been able to get up here because every time there's, like... you know, something.

Um, this is the first time I feel like it's been pretty clear for me to walk up here.

He was a good, good, good, good person, a good man.

And this is not how anybody deserved to go.

♪ ♪ >> SULLIVAN: The whole place is elevated, up pretty high.

>> Exactly!

I thought for sure, his apartment would be fine.

I was like, it's on stilts.

>> SULLIVAN: Do you think they're going to rebuild here?

>> SULLIVAN: So they're just going to fix 'em up?

>> SULLIVAN: Wow-- and then rent 'em out again?

>> I think so.

>> SULLIVAN: What do you think?

>> I think that's a terrible idea.

I, I can't see how that could be a good idea.

>> SULLIVAN: Do you worry that knowing that the river did come 26 feet up these buildings, that it could do it again?

>> Sure.

We don't know anything anymore.

What we thought we knew doesn't exist, so why not?

Why couldn't it do it again?

>> SULLIVAN: It's unclear what the future plans are for the property.

♪ ♪ But just about everywhere we went around Asheville, people were eager to put homes and businesses back the way they were.

Thousands of people were still displaced.

Unemployment was high, and the once-bustling Asheville tourist area of Biltmore Village felt like a ghost town.

>> SULLIVAN: Moe's looks about the same.

>> Yeah, and so does Asaka.

I mean those things are going to have to be completely rebuilt.

>> SULLIVAN: Kit Kramer, the head of the Asheville-area chamber of commerce, has seen bad flooding before.

This was Biltmore Village's third in 20 years.

>> This is a tourist area and it's one of the most popular places to visit in this whole state.

>> SULLIVAN: What's the most important thing to you right now?

>> I want people to be able to work again and support their families.

>> SULLIVAN: It's like get back in here, get our businesses open.

>> And we can work on the remediation pieces.

We can work on coming back in a better way along the way.

>> SULLIVAN: So if you lose this neighborhood... >> Just can't happen.

>> SULLIVAN: Can't?

>> Cannot happen.

We've got to have it back.

>> SULLIVAN: So you're thinking, let's get the businesses open >> Right.

>> SULLIVAN: And let's worry about the resiliency... >> As we're working on things.

I also think it is imperative that we be thinking in those terms the entire time that we're redeveloping.

>> SULLIVAN: Yeah.

>> But first and foremost, businesses need to reopen and jobs need to be created again.

♪ ♪ >> SULLIVAN: I went to city hall to speak to the mayor, Esther Manheimer, about the rebuilding effort.

>> When I talk to property owners, they have a great deal of concern about a future event affecting their property regardless, and so they're really debating, do I make this kind of investment again, knowing this could happen?

>> SULLIVAN: So if the city wanted to tell people, look, we want you to build to a higher standard, could you do that?

>> What we can do is we can provide them with an advisory regarding where-- what height to build to given this flood event.

>> SULLIVAN: So you can't tell them to do it, but you can ask nicely.

>> We can only enforce the building code.

We can't make you exceed the state building code.

>> SULLIVAN: The rules here do have some elevation and storm mitigation requirements.

But the mayor told us they don't account enough for new climate realities.

FEMA has said strong building codes are critical, but that the existing ones in most states are outdated and ineffective, with North Carolina's being among the worst.

>> Look, if we could get everyone to adhere to current code requirements or even strengthened code requirements to try to prevent this sort of effect of a disaster on a community, we could lessen the overall disruption to a community, the hit on the economy, on the lives of the people, and we would rebound from it quicker-- but I think individual property owners would say, "Well, why do I have to bear the burden of that?"

>> SULLIVAN: We headed to the hills outside Asheville, where some of the worst devastation occurred.

Thousands of mudslides left 23 dead.

We met Allegra West back on the hillside where her neighbors were swept away.

>> This is the house that came across here.

It was upside down and across the road.

>> SULLIVAN: It's kind of amazing seeing the yellow house because when we were here last time, there was a house inside the house.

(voiceover): The area had been mostly cleaned up, but James and Judy Dockery's belongings were still scattered around.

(on camera): These are the things that belong to them?

>> Yeah, definitely.

Their ice trays and kitchen wares.

>> SULLIVAN: I mean, you see a whole life here, right?

God, you really find everybody's things right here.

>> Oh, my goodness.

>> SULLIVAN: James Dockery.

>> James Dockery.

(exhales softly) >> SULLIVAN: Despite the devastation and the threat of mudslides, neighbors were already making plans to rebuild.

(on camera): When people are talking about rebuilding, are they talking about safety, mudslides, flooding?

>> I think not enough.

Not enough.

There are many people who are thinking about that, but most people kind of just have the blinders on of survival, of just getting basic needs met and getting things rebuilt-- there's definitely a grit to this area where, you know, people have been here generations and families have been on this land and they're going to continue to stay here.

♪ ♪ >> It's your decision, really, whether you want to take that kind of a risk and say, oh, I'm going to build back and it's not going to be built as it should be built.

What's going to happen in 60 years?

Are we going to be washing people away again?

I don't know.

>> SULLIVAN: Kim Wooten is an engineer who spent a decade working on the state's building codes.

(power tool whirring) Do you think that we can build for these storms that are coming?

>> Yes.

We can build stronger homes.

We make sure that we're not building in not only floodplains current, but projected floodplains-- we can make sure that homes are built to withstand winds, increasingly strong winds that they could receive during a hurricane.

We can do all kinds of things to build better.

That does cost money.

But what's the life worth?

What are your memories worth?

Do you really want to see, you know, your children die in a flood?

What is that worth?

What price do you put on that?

I don't know.

>> SULLIVAN: What do you say to people who say, "Look, "this was 26 feet of water in some places.

"There's nothing you can build that will protect you against 26 feet of water."?

>> That's true.

It's absolutely true.

You just don't build there.

>> SULLIVAN: The federal government has weighed into this debate.

Through FEMA, it runs a flood insurance program and makes maps that delineate the riskiest areas.

Those seeking coverage for rebuilding are typically required to take steps to mitigate against future flood damage.

>> We have a climate scientist on this side, a data scientist to take all the climate hazard.

>> SULLIVAN: Jeremy Porter is a data scientist who studies flood risk and has analyzed FEMA's maps.

>> On the map, you can see the FEMA flood zones in Asheville.

>> SULLIVAN: All right.

>> They do a pretty good job of capturing the major rivers that come through Asheville.

>> SULLIVAN: Yeah, here are all the big rivers in Asheville.

>> When you add in the 100 year flood layer from First Street, ultimately what we end up seeing is a tremendous amount of risk on these streams that are sort of offshoots of the major, major rivers.

>> SULLIVAN Wow.

>> If you go back and read about the actual flooding that occurred, in these areas are where we saw a lot of the major flooding.

>> SULLIVAN: This is where a lot of the flooding was.

>> In particular we looked at North Carolina after Helene came through, right, and ultimately, we found that only about two percent of the properties that were impacted actually were in a FEMA zone.

>> SULLIVAN: And 98 percent of the properties were not?

>> Yeah-- anywhere in the Appalachian region, the models just aren't developed to pick up heavy precipitation events.

♪ ♪ >> SULLIVAN: Porter found a similar situation around the country.

When you looked at the picture nationally, how different were your maps from FEMA's?

>> We found about 2.2 times as many properties had one-in-a-hundred year flood risk.

>> SULLIVAN: More than twice as many people in America have a flood risk that aren't even aware that they have a flood risk?

>> Yeah, it, it's a huge issue.

>> SULLIVAN: This is an issue that has come up repeatedly during my reporting on disasters.

Over the past eight months, I've been tracking how rebuilding has worked out in some of those previous storms, and whether those places are any safer today.

I went back to Staten Island recently, which was hit hard by Superstorm Sandy in 2012.

>> Sandy makes landfall slamming into the East Coast.

>> That 12-foot surge came right into these neighborhoods.

>> SULLIVAN: It was one of the worst flooding events in New York's history.

And billions were poured into the rebuilding effort.

I headed to a part of Oakwood Beach, a neighborhood that had been touted as a model for how to protect communities from future disasters.

It once had a couple hundred homes... before it was decimated by Sandy.

>> We were very close together, very close-knit.

Everybody knew each other.

>> SULLIVAN: Joe Tirone, who'd owned a house here, took me around.

>> Now, this is where my house was.

See that ridge?

That right there?

That was my backyard, that little-- >> SULLIVAN: This one?

>> Yeah, right here.

Right here.

>> SULLIVAN: After the storm, Tirone learned of a federal program meant to help state and local governments offer buyouts to homeowners in high-risk areas.

He organized his neighbors to apply for the buyouts.

>> This was a multi-generational neighborhood.

So the grandmothers, grandparents lived across from the grandchildren, so there forever.

But on that block that I had my home, three people had perished.

So this is like, you know, they, they had to get out.

There's about 100 yards and that is where the ocean is.

>> SULLIVAN: Within a couple years, most of Tirone's neighborhood and some other parts of Staten Island had taken the buyout.

>> New York Governor Andrew Cuomo visited Oakwood Beach.

>> Thank you very much.

>> SULLIVAN: Governor Andrew Cuomo was promising to return the area to nature, a natural buffer against future storms.

>> We're now rebuilding oyster beds, wetlands, and marshlands and grasslands.

Why?

Because they all had a purpose.

They were all part of the balance.

♪ ♪ >> SULLIVAN: But after spending $200 million, it hasn't quite worked out that way.

So why does this have a fence?

>> This is the exact area that the Staten Island Soccer League purchased from the state for some nominal amount, and they're gonna build their soccer fields here.

>> SULLIVAN (voiceover): The state allowed the league to purchase six acres of the buyout land, for fields, seating, and there's talk of a clubhouse.

Is this what you thought was gonna happen when you sold your property?

>> No.

I thought that it was just gonna be like a big marsh and that, you know, I wouldn't even be able to get to my property.

I thought the, the streets would be gone.

It'd just be paths.

It'd just be natural areas.

It would be some real environmentally friendly... >> SULLIVAN: Yeah.

>> That's what I pictured.

>> SULLIVAN (voiceover): Just steps away from the planned soccer complex, Tirone showed me still-existing homes that had flooded during Sandy.

(to Tirone): Can you explain this to me?

Because I'm seeing empty fields, and then I'm seeing a neighborhood right next to it.

(voiceover): And new homes that had gone up, too.

>> That's a semi-attached home right there, which probably was a bungalow or two.

>> SULLIVAN: Right.

What do you think when you see this?

>> They're definitely vulnerable without a doubt.

If this had a 15-foot wave, not gonna say that's gonna happen in the next year or two, but the fact that it was a 15-foot wave says that these people are at risk.

>> This area got walloped during the storm.

>> SULLIVAN (voiceover): I asked the Staten Island borough president Vito Fossella about the patchwork that this area had become since Sandy.

>> I, I think the end result was a hodgepodge of things.

>> SULLIVAN: Okay.

>> From a condemnation of homes, people who lived there for generations had to move... >> SULLIVAN: Like this one?

>> Then here you have people with homes were destroyed.

They just decided to move along.

I think bureaucracy, for lack of a better word, caused it to go on for years and years and years.

Other people wanted to stay and keep their roots here.

>> SULLIVAN: He told me that he supported re-developing here, even in buyout areas.

>> You have some of the best views around, and underappreciated, of the water.

We should, uh, welcome people to build near the water when possible and bring life back as opposed to watching empty lots.

So I would be a proponent of that.

>> SULLIVAN: Interesting.

So taxpayers spent a lot of money... >> Mm-hmm.

>> SULLIVAN: ...buying out these properties.

Was it all for nothing?

>> I don't know if it was all for nothing.

I think in some cases it was justified.

Uh, people didn't have a recourse.

And there were those that said, you can't go back in there.

It's just totally unsafe.

Sometimes the pendulum swings too far in one direction.

And maybe it becomes time to reevaluate some of those decisions and see where it is safe that people can move back in.

>> SULLIVAN: What if those people come back to live and make the most of what they've got, but they end up under 18 feet of water, and their homes are destroyed and more people die?

>> Well, that's what I'm saying.

If we have the mechanisms to, to mitigate against that, then by all means.

But if we're just gonna live in fear forever, it's probably not the way I want to live, frankly.

>> We think about disasters always happening to somebody else or always somewhere else.

And to a certain degree, I think it's because we've always priced risk below what it really takes to change behavior.

>> SULLIVAN: Craig Fugate was the head of FEMA during Sandy and as the recovery unfolded.

And when you look at Sandy, when you look at how that area recovered from that storm, what do you think?

>> We put a lot of stuff right back where it was.

I mean, Mayor Bloomberg was really trying to get to how do I mitigate against future storms?

But when they started looking at the cost and what it would involve to protect everything, they realized that really wasn't going to be practical.

So they went back, and they did things like, "Okay, well, can we at least figure out how to block the subways so they don't get salt water?"

So, things like that.

Can we make improvements and elevate critical equipment?

I think when you go in these areas, you see the recovery's gone well.

There is some mitigation.

But it should not lead anybody to the impression that it won't happen again.

You put that much water in that area, we're still gonna have impacts.

>> SULLIVAN: So you think if, if Sandy happened again tomorrow...?

>> We might have done better on protecting the subways.

But I think as far as homes go?

>> SULLIVAN: Yeah.

>> As far as the small businesses... >> SULLIVAN: Yeah.

>> ...I think there's this tendency that we think, "Well, it won't happen again."

And I'm like, "Yeah, it will."

You know, to say it won't be as bad, that's hard to say.

>> SULLIVAN: After Sandy... FEMA and the city clashed over updating the flood maps and have so far left them largely unchanged.

>> FEMA goes back and forth with the city of New York on what the actual maps are gonna look like.

And ultimately, we're leaving a lot of residents in an area that have flood risk without flood insurance and without the knowledge that they have that risk.

I think it's a politically wildly unpopular thing to do to go in and say, "Let's change the flood maps," and then your constituents see that you've just increased the flood risk flood insurance requirements by double in your community.

And it's just something that no one's wanted to tackle to this point.

Why did New York City fight FEMA in expanding the flood maps?

>> The city's thinking about its tax revenues.

It wants that $2 billion growing to $3 billion a year in tax revenue and is afraid to discourage growth in the areas that FEMA thinks are gonna be at risk, and therefore insurers might not provide insurance for, and now growth is harder.

>> SULLIVAN (voiceover): Brad Lander is comptroller of New York City and candidate for mayor, who's studied the growth in development since Sandy.

>> Right now, basically 30% of New Yorkers live in the 100-year floodplain.

>> SULLIVAN: Wow.

>> The real estate value in the floodplain is $176 billion.

>> SULLIVAN: Is that what you thought was gonna happen after...?

>> Whoo.

I mean, this... we have these dual crises.

We have an affordability crisis, and we are desperate for more housing.

And we have a climate crisis that, when it wallops you, like it did in Sandy, those days, you're really looking at it.

And then the sun comes out again, and it kind of recedes from memory.

And we are not as good as we need to be at putting those things together.

>> SULLIVAN: This tension between development and how to deal with future storm risk always seems to play out in the aftermath of these disasters, and development usually has the upper hand.

I saw that vividly in 2017... in a part of Houston I visited in the days after Hurricane Harvey.

It was the third major storm in three years here, flooding more than 150,000 structures and killing 36 people.

There's something incredibly surreal about driving a boat down a neighborhood street.

We came across Joseph Hernandez returning to his house for the first time.

Where do you begin?

>> I don't know.

I mean, I'm just gonna wait and see.

I mean, I guess I have to throw away everything.

There's no other way.

You know, I have to gut the house and redo it, I guess.

If possible.

>> SULLIVAN: Did you not think it would flood here?

>> No, I didn't.

You know, when we left, the water was up to the curb, up to the, uh, driveway, and I thought, "Man, maybe it's going get by the door or something like that."

>> SULLIVAN: Do you have flood insurance?

>> No, I just have regular insurance.

>> SULLIVAN: Just regular.

>> Yeah.

So we don't... >> SULLIVAN: How come not flood?

>> Because in the flooding areas, they make you buy flood insurance.

But here wasn't a flood area, so... >> SULLIVAN: You were not required to get it.

>> Not required.

That's right.

So, I don't... many people around here, they don't have it.

>> SULLIVAN: His house was in a neighborhood just behind the Addicks and Barker dams.

The Army Corps of Engineers built them to protect Houston from its perpetual problems with flooding.

But during Harvey, water backed up in the reservoirs behind the dams and flooded thousands of homeowners like him.

♪ ♪ We returned to Houston recently and met Charles Irvine, an attorney who represents homeowners still seeking compensation for the flooding.

This is the highest point to the Barker Dam, yeah.

>> SULLIVAN: Of the Barker Dam.

Oh, wow.

>> And if you walk over here, you'll see... >> SULLIVAN: Oh, that's a... >> ...the water that's been collected.

>> SULLIVAN: Just a little bit this way, they put houses.

>> About five miles.

>> SULLIVAN: So if you go this way, and there's enough rain, all this water is gonna back up into those homes.

>> It's a big, flat pond.

And as the water rises, it moves further back.

Finally it hits the neighborhoods.

>> SULLIVAN: The neighborhoods he was talking about were the ones we had visited right after the storm.

The community's vulnerability dates back to when Houston was one of the fastest-growing cities in the country.

Over the years, more than 20,000 homes were built inside the reservoirs.

>> Well, there was private property that would be flooded back behind the dams kind of at the back end of the dams, if you will, the back end of the reservoirs.

>> SULLIVAN: Jim Blackburn is a prominent environmental lawyer in Houston.

>> And that private property ended up being developed.

If you're a private landowner, you could develop that land.

♪ ♪ >> SULLIVAN: The Army Corps of Engineers began looking at ways to mitigate the flood risks in the reservoirs.

They even considered a dramatic move, like in Staten Island-- a buyout of properties inside Addicks and Barker.

But no one wanted to spend that much money, and the cost of trying to undertake something like that now has skyrocketed to as much as $13 billion.

Did anybody think in these previous decades that maybe it wasn't the best idea to build 20,000 homes in a reservoir meant to hold water during a storm?

>> Um, many people did think that.

>> SULLIVAN: Okay.

>> In fact, we have... during the course of the lawsuit, we found that there were some developers who... whose engineers, before the development was built, would write to the Corps of Engineers and say, "Hey, is this really in a reservoir?

And they would say, "Yeah, it is."

♪ ♪ >> SULLIVAN: Since 2017, the Army Corps and Harris county have tried to do some flood mitigation, including shoring up the dams, and improving the drainage and storage systems.

The county's flood control district is led by Tina Peterson.

If Harvey happened again, those homes in the reservoirs would flood again.

>> Yeah.

I think that, you know, I can't say that all of them would.

I can't really project, because I know we have done work.

>> SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

>> So... but there is a... there is some residual flood risk that exists.

>> SULLIVAN: Do you worry that the incremental nature of this effort to handle this water, that it's not enough?

>> That's a great question.

We talk about this all the time.

So the work that we do is very incremental.

And we see an opportunity, we do, you know, something to address that specific location, and we have visions for finding ways to do something transformational.

♪ ♪ >> The Houston metro housing market, it is so hot, with prices soaring.

>> SULLIVAN: Meanwhile, since Harvey, the real estate market has been thriving, with nearly 5,000 homes sold in the reservoirs.

>> Right now is a great time to buy.

>> SULLIVAN: One of them was Joseph Hernandez's house.

♪ ♪ When we found it again, it had just been sold for a second time.

From the real estate listing, it was clear it had been completely renovated.

♪ ♪ It looked as though it had never flooded at all.

>> We've always had this view that we could build our way out of problems-- concrete channels, levees.

Whatever the problem, there was an engineering solution for it, and I think that served us well.

I think we were always behind on playing catch-up with development.

The storms that we're looking at in the future are so much larger than what we designed for in the past that I don't think we'll be able to catch up.

I think we're going to have to learn to live with water in a way that we've never lived with water.

I think what we're going to keep seeing is that the water is going to rise higher than you planned for.

>> SULLIVAN: It's going to keep coming.

>> It’s going to keep coming and at some point, we’re just going to determine it makes more sense not to occupy these high-risk areas that keep flooding again and again and again.

>> It's a fair chunk of Houston.

♪ ♪ >> As we start with the program tonight, we first want to remember all of the citizens who we've lost here.

>> SULLIVAN: On our trips to North Carolina in the months after Helene... ...we saw how the community's sense of safety had been shattered.

>> Mere words cannot match the depth of the sorrow of those left behind.

>> SULLIVAN: 107 people were ultimately confirmed dead from the storm.

>> One family in Buncombe County lost 11 people to the storm.

>> SULLIVAN: On this hillside outside Asheville, heavy rain triggered multiple landslides, killing 13 people.

>> This is a catastrophic storm.

And this is one of the most catastrophic debris flow events in terms of human life, loss of human life, that we've had in North Carolina for... >> SULLIVAN: In North Carolina.

>> ...just individual debris flows in one site.

>> SULLIVAN: Rick Wooten is a geologist who worked for a decade on a state database that predicts where landslides will most likely occur.

This hillside was marked in the database.

(to Wooten): Have there been landslides here before?

>> Yes.

>> SULLIVAN: There have?

>> There's been at least one debris flow event that we can see in the older deposits.

>> SULLIVAN: You can see that in the rocks?

>> You can see that in... >> SULLIVAN: That there was a landslide here before?

>> Yes.

>> SULLIVAN: It's not just a freak thing that happens.

This is actually sort of a predictable natural pattern.

>> Right.

So, it's part of the, the natural geologic processes that have gone on in the mountains here for over a million years.

♪ ♪ >> SULLIVAN: Many counties here have restrictions on building in landslide-prone areas.

But Wooten said the strength of the rules vary widely.

And ten counties haven't been mapped in the database at all.

Wooten said that's largely because, for several years, the state cut funding, delaying the project.

The statement that was made in the legislature at the time, the argument that won the day to cut the funding was "The landslide hazard mapping is just a backdoor approach to more regulations."

♪ ♪ >> SULLIVAN: In 2007, State Representative Susan Fisher said she began running into similar opposition to bills that would have created statewide safety regulations to protect people from landslides.

So you were worried people were gonna build... >> Yeah.

>> SULLIVAN: ...in dangerous places?

>> Yeah, and, and just indiscriminately.

What they needed to know more about is how dangerous that could be, not only for their own homes, but for the homes down below.

So... >> SULLIVAN: And what happened to that?

>> Nothing.

There was a lot of arguing, um, about how stringent we wanted to make the law around steep slopes.

>> SULLIVAN: Who do you think didn't like them?

>> I think that anyone who was representing developers or home builders didn't want that bill.

When you look at what the North Carolina Home Builders Association represents, they want business for their builders.

And if the requirements are too stringent, that means they're gonna have to spend more money to build.

They don't want to have to do that.

♪ ♪ >> SULLIVAN: I went to the Homebuilders Association headquarters in Raleigh and spoke with one of the group's chief lobbyists, a former state legislator, Chris Millis.

>> We're very focused on affordability and also just making sure that individuals can be able to get into a home at some point in their lives.

>> SULLIVAN: He told me statewide steep slope legislation is unnecessary and counterprodutive because many local communities have such rules, and can establish regulations that reflect their communities' needs.

>> We're keeping an eye out for all state-level regulations and just making sure the rules that are being put in place is done so in a way, uh, that's protecting life and safety as it relates to, uh, building codes and the development industry, but it's done so in a way that's affordable so North Carolina families can afford, uh, some type of residential dwelling of their choice.

♪ ♪ >> SULLIVAN: The year before Helene, the Home Builders faced criticism for their role in another bill impacting the state's building codes, which were scheduled to be updated for the first time since 2018.

Critics said the bill left important codes unchanged and out of date and left homes less able to withstand severe storms.

We obtained extensive correspondence that the legislative committee chairman had about the bill.

Much of it was with the Home Builders lobby.

(to Millis): In this email that is sent to you, the lawmaker lists the nine things that they're putting in the code, and he's asking you, "Let me know if I missed something."

>> Because we are experts in regard to the chapters that are applied to different aspects of residential construction.

So we are providing input to lawmakers that are gonna be going through a committee process to make sure that we're answering his question in regard to what detail needs to be, uh, addressed.

And so I don't, I don't understand... >> SULLIVAN: Are you... >> ...the concern.

Is this email that you're referring to some email that I'm on?

>> SULLIVAN: Yes.

Are you guys experts, or are you advocates for an industry that wants to build in a way that makes them more money?

>> Oh, absolutely not.

Uh, we have experts on our staff.

We have a director of codes that is most certainly an expert in building codes.

He's a former employee at the Department of Insurance, and he lives and breathes all thing building code.

And so we most certainly are experts in regard to how the code applies to residential construction.

>> SULLIVAN: Millis insisted that the codes the bill left unchanged had nothing to do with storm resiliency, and that the group will always prioritize public safety.

Since Helene, he said the group is concerned about requiring storm victims to rebuild and elevate older homes to newer, potentially costly standards.

>> I believe there needs to be a distinction moving forward.

I think policymakers should consider this, that when someone's rebuilding after a natural disaster... >> SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

>> ...an existing community, giving them the option to be able to rebuild what they had before, I think is needed.

>> SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

>> But to prohibit individuals to be able to use the, the free use of their own property, to me is a chilling prospect.

>> SULLIVAN: Hmm.

>> And I believe that individuals of western North Carolina are going to come to this reality very soon.

♪ ♪ >> SULLIVAN: Recently, the legislature postponed implementing its updates to the state codes in the wake of the storm.

And they're even considering letting people rebuild without meeting existing codes, which are based on ten-year-old standards.

>> Donald Trump has signed a flurry of executive orders.

>> SULLIVAN: Nationally, the Trump administration has also taken steps that stop enforcing some rules for flood-prone areas... ...and end funding to help communities update building codes.

>> The time is now to build a safer, stronger North Carolina.

>> SULLIVAN: North Carolina's new governor, Democrat Josh Stein, has been pushing to speed up the rebuilding process.

But he's also expressed concerns about how it's done.

>> Whenever you rebuild after a storm, you do not want to be where you were, three years from now, exactly where you are today when the next storm hits.

And we will take measures to make sure that does not happen.

>> SULLIVAN: It's very hard to do that, politically, is it not?

>> We'll see.

The risks are real.

There were stories where it was front page national news that Asheville was the climate change safe center in this country.

And we now know that is not the case.

Even the mountains can experience flooding and hurricanes that we didn't think was possible.

And the work it takes to rebuild is years and years and years.

And so, I, I would not wish this on anyone.

We have got to understand that these things are real.

And anything we can do now to mitigate those risks, we should do.

♪ ♪ >> SULLIVAN: In the spring, we went back to Swannanoa, to the now-empty neighborhood where Nola and Robert Ramsuer had last been seen.

Their bodies were eventually found down the river, about a mile apart.

At the time, the land was on the market.

The real estate listing touted its "abundant river frontage," and potential use as a mobile home park.

"This versatile property could serve as a number of potential"... (voiceover): I showed the ad to Shalana Jordan.

(to Jordan): What do you think about them wanting to redevelop that area?

>> I mean, I don't think they should do it, obviously, because of what happened.

And, I mean, there were people who were trapped in their trailers for 12-plus hours because it took so long for the waters to recede and be safe to try to come help them.

You know?

It's a nightmare.

>> SULLIVAN: Right.

>> Everyone else is lucky that they even survived from the trailer park.

I mean, at this point, I don't, I wouldn't live in Asheville again, after going through something like that.

>> SULLIVAN: In the town of Hendersonville, I met Republican Congressman Chuck Edwards.

He represents some of the worst-affected areas, including Swannanoa.

He cautioned against being too fearful about the future.

What do you think the likelihood is that a storm like that would come again?

>> Well, they are describing this as a 1,000-year flood event.

And so I th...

I think... >> SULLIVAN: Do you believe that?

>> Uh, yes.

>> SULLIVAN: You do.

>> None of, none of us have ever, ever seen anything like this.

Nobody in my family's past has ever seen anything... >> SULLIVAN: Statistically, the storms have gotten more frequent, more severe.

Even here in Appalachia, you've had several major storms in the past couple decades.

What makes you think a storm like this won't happen again?

>> There's no guarantee a storm like this won't happen again, but I think everything is a risk.

There's no, there's no guarantee.

>> SULLIVAN: Yeah.

>> I'd like to see the property owner be able to better assess that risk than, uh, some government-mandated agency.

Life is a gamble.

But property owners should be able to make up their own mind how they want to rebuild.

♪ ♪ >> SULLIVAN: I'd seen this area go through the unimaginable... ...and like so many others, struggle with how to rebuild.

But with more devastating storms inevitable, the question now is not just what will happen in North Carolina, but who will face this challenge next, and how will they respond when they do?

(birds chirping, cars passing) ♪ ♪ >> NARRATOR: Go to pbs.org/frontline for more reporting with our partners at NPR.

>> Going back to superstorm Sandy’s destruction in New York and New Jersey.

Hurricane Maria that plunged Puerto Rico into darkness.

Irma, that tore through Florida.

And Harvey, that left much of Houston under water.

>> That is equivalent to about a trillion gallons of water.

>> NARRATOR: Connect with FRONTLINE on Facebook and Instagram and stream anytime on the PBS app, YouTube, or pbs.org/frontline.

Captioned by Media Access Group at WGBH access.wgbh.org ♪ ♪ >> For more on this and other "FRONTLINE" programs, visit our website at pbs.org/frontline.

♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ FRONTLINE's "Hurricane Helene's Deadly Warning" is available on Amazon Prime Video.

♪ ♪